Revamp Hooks [With Source Files]

Because, it will change the whole gameplay.
There is physics on the hook. Bendind the hook means change the physics or make graphics and physics inconsistent.

Btw, personnaly, in "source files", I understand source code. So I m a bit disappointed, but it may be only me.

Anyway, I like the graphics, but I cant imagine it in the gameplay.

Nice idea, as always! I think I've seen it before though, but it must've been long ago.

I would also advocate some experimentation, like heinrich said. Hard to judge how it would play out in actual gamplay without trying around a bit (regardless of it being purely visual or also affecting the physics).
I also really like the look of your rope hook!

Btw: Congrats on your belief!

Loving TW since 2010

Thanks for the nice comments.

Sorry about this. Should I change it to Art Source Files?

Thank you.  I just come at it with an artistic mind. This game is mostly perfect,  there are a few things here and there that could be fixed or added, but most of my problems are the design of a few things.  I have a lot of ideas on how to make Teeworlds look better,  I just try to present them in a highly graphical why so that people can see my ideas.  I could make the same post with out them and the impact would not be as great.

I posted this in the Sticky: [SUGGESTION] Ideas for the next version thread a while back but I did not go into this much detail.

I think it would be funny to see a tee wrapped around a small one by one tile.

I think that this definitely would need some playing around with.  Someone should give it a try and send me a link to test it

Why it'll change gameplay? For me, it would be cosmetic change. Without any changes in physics for sure. Now hook just goes through blocks, but it could work like on screenshots

• How would gameplay look? There is Worms: Armageddon(by Team17), very old but still played, and there are some servers where players using hook freaking good.
  

• It would eliminate all(but basic, where is no hooking through) hooking skills players have, and will force them to start learn again for the new physics. As said above, ddracers won't like it, coz this would kill ddrace(as it is), you probably noticed that most players are on ddraces servers, so don't expect a big "wow nice, I'd really like to play it" from real players, but rather a big "lame bullshit, I hate it so much, but not as much as you!!! go and **** ******** ******* *****".
  

• Current system hooking only affecting player velocity, with a value which is depending on direction and distance to the hooked point, pretty simple, isn't it? But with collision checking, long hooking(which happens really often, not on just ddrace servers) would take more time to compute, and will decrease performance. Attempts to decrease collisions points to decrease computations and increase perfomance, would just produce glitches and bugs, which are not better than lags.
  

So I believe this will never be added to vanilla teeworlds, even as an optional sv_use_ropelike_hooks.
Maybe in some mod...

Easily, in gameplay, physics would be the same, but it would draw hooks as they are wrapped, sure, bugs and glitches included!

Yah I guess it could be like Hedgewars or Worms.  The chain would grow the further the Tee moves away from the chains hit point.  It would be cool if you could climb up and down the chain like in Hedgewars as well but that is for a different post.

Yah I can see how this could make people mad.  But as people have pointed out and I discuss further below I now think this could be done without changing the games hook physics.

This could always be a client side graphical thing.  There could be a switch to go back to the look of the old hooks.  This way people who like it can play with it on, and people who do not like it or can not play the game with it on can turn it off.

I now understand how you could keep the physics as they are today.  In the image below the yellow circle represents the maximum distance the tee can be away from the spot where the hook hits.  The Green line shows how the chain physics are today. The pink line shows the angle of the hook when it hits an object.  This feature could be in such a way that the physics do not change but the chain still looks like it is warping around tiles.  There are two problems that I think would break this realism however and that is shown in the next two sections. 

Currently the Tee moves toward the chains hit point until it reaches it or the Tee can not move any further because of tiles that are in the way.  This is not a problem when the player can see that the chain has gone through the wall.  But if the old chain were to become transparent and a new chain would wrap around tiles it would make these situations look odd.  Imagine you can not see the green or pink lines...  Why don't the Tees fall?  Why does gravity now pull them down so that they are dangling from the chain where it bends off the edge?  These physics would seem to be odd.  Not game physics but real (Tee)world physics.

Yes I hope some experiments at least be tried before a feature just flat out get denied.  This could completely work without chainging the physics and improve the look of the game.

What???

He means a thing like in your middle picture:
Nowadays the Tee would "stick" to the wall, because he get's pulled towards it.
With the new hook the Tee should - by the looks of it - get pulled down instead by the rope, and then around the corner so he finally hangs on the other side.
If the new hook would be purely cosmetical, it would feel very strange if the Tee still sticks to the wall, like in that example.

--

Your fresh look of the rope gave me another idea: The new rope could be used as a power up. It would have different physics than the old one and on pickup you would be able to use it for a limited time, like the katana.
It could give you some extra movement possibilities, which we'd have to think about first.
An example could be, that you could bend your hook around edges by moving in the opposite direction and then let yourself be pulled by the rope. That way, you could accelerate yourself by a fair bit. This would be an alternative to the grenade, which doesn't cost you any health and has a stronger effect than the normal hook.
Just some brainstorming.

Edit: On the other side, the physics would look inconsistent that way, as one hook still moves trough tiles and the other one doesn't.

Loving TW since 2010

Yes it would have to be a server and client side change, but what I was saying is if the physics do not change then it could be the client that renders the hooks.  That way when I play I could have it turned on, and if someone who does not like it or does not have a computer that can handle it they can turn it off.  Kinda like how far you can see in Minecraft.  If you game is running slow you can turn it off and go back to the classic hooks.

I don't know how often this happens but it would look strange when it does.  The hook could disappear from the other side of the wall and move to the side the Tee is on.  This way it looks as though the Tee grabbed the wall and let go of the hook.  It could still be "hooked" to the other side of the wall with the invisible old hook, but just redraw the new hook when these situations happen.  I think that would be the best way to explain away why you connect to the walls. 

If you are more than a tile away when from the hook hit spot when and you stop before reaching the hit spot the hook would redraw from the Tee to the nearest wall as if they were to hook it.  What do you all think about that?

It would have to resound the sound that plays when then hook hits something so the player would know that the Tee rebooked to grab the wall.

It was just a suggestion.  You are right though there are situations where the Tee will get pushed back to the other side.  The player can even do it.  I think we need to see it to determine whether or not it can work. Then it can be tweaked a bit.  I just don't know how else to do it and keep the same physics. 

Anyone have any ideas?

Yes I guess expectation is an issue with this.