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Topic: [SUGGESTION] Rune Mod idea for the next version

The post was originally posted in this thread // Landil

Just wrote some dirty lines of code just to express the idea of runes a bit better.
Didnt implement any graphics or serious useful content.
Rune Source
Rune_teeworlds_srv.exe
Pls dont report any bugs or posts how shitty is it.
Powerup_Ninja will unleash now any of 5 Powerups/Runes: Ninja, Regeneration, Health, Ammo, Invisibility, Speed (reload). Gametype: Rune as CTF, nothing else can be chosen.
Try on ctf2 best.

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Re: [SUGGESTION] Rune Mod idea for the next version

Slayer *gV* wrote:

Just wrote some dirty lines of code just to express the idea of runes a bit better.
Didnt implement any graphics or serious useful content.
Rune Source
Rune_teeworlds_srv.exe
Pls dont report any bugs or posts how shitty is it.
Powerup_Ninja will unleash now any of 5 Powerups/Runes: Ninja, Regeneration, Health, Ammo, Invisibility, Speed (reload). Gametype: Rune as CTF, nothing else can be chosen.
Try on ctf2 best.

Well, as I am the guy for da gfx. Don't call it runes, call it hats. Then we could think up more creative ways show the effects.

I will test it later. Have you already done some massive testing with other players?

edit: hehe post 1337 in this thread.

Antoine de Saint Exupéry: It seems that perfection is reached not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.
Besides -  I am the gfx guy!

3 (edited by Slayer *gV* 2013-08-13 17:22:36)

Re: [SUGGESTION] Rune Mod idea for the next version

I didn't do any real testings. As I said, are it only few really dirty written lines of codes to express the idea. Nothing that should be taken serious or could have any chance to find the way into this game.

Hats are a really funny idea, but the visual effects should be unique and descriptive, what could be difficult with hats only.

What i didn't implement was a shield. E.g. could it block front/ top/ back - damage for few seconds, or block 10 (?) damage generally, rising your max. health to 30.

If you want to take this idea serious, maybe open a new thread to get massive feedback and ideas to specify which "hats" and what they do. Iam pretty sure some ideas will find more acceptance than others, and also there could be very different perceptions of their usefulness and power (and they should get balanced according to our high level scene, which i don't belong to ;-) )

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Re: [SUGGESTION] Rune Mod idea for the next version

Zodiac wrote:

About the chat, maybe only use a sound when someone uses your name in a message.

That would be acceptable, although a seperate mute chat option wouldnt hurt aswell. Both may be an improvement.

Slayer *gV* wrote:

Personally, i doubt a rune to give you slow regeneration (like 1 heart/s for 10s) won't break the gameplay at all.

I doubt that it will not completely break the game. Why do you need those powerups? If someone needs hearts then collect them, but adding a option to randomly (based on powerup spawn) regenerate 10 hearts without going through the process of finding and collecting them while escaping gives you a huge advantage. Especially the last point.
While a normal player needs to excape and collect those hearts, which also proves his movement skills, the player with this powerup even can fight normally while getting his hearts auto filled up. You take away a big part of traditional tactics and skills required (escaping, movement). Why? The only reasons i can think of are making new players starts easier, and adding diversity for its own purpose. Both are not worth to sacrifice what you need to to add it.

I think Landil's signature says best what i try to tell you.

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Re: [SUGGESTION] Rune Mod idea for the next version

Arrob wrote:

I doubt that it will not completely break the game.

Maybe it will "break", or better: "change"

Arrob wrote:

a big part of traditional tactics

Coz it will add another tactical spot you have to fight for. You cant just camp in your base or run stupid into the opponents base. You have to be strategic. Maybe the mid will become a very important role, who knows?
It also will differ from map to map for sure.

Arrob wrote:

Why do you need those powerups?

To add tactics beside of defend and attack.

Arrob wrote:

If someone needs hearts then collect them

Yes. You can go and collect them, or collect a powerup. But better take a big load of luck with you, maybe it is only a regeneration rune, that will break upon the first impact, meaning you wont get anything - too bad.
Anyway, you are right. With runes you will have TWO possibilities. Make your choice!

Arrob wrote:

10 hearts without going through the process of finding and collecting them while escaping gives you a huge advantage. Especially the last point.

This one is easy: Get the powerup before he can get it. But needs some tactics...

Arrob wrote:

While a normal player needs to excape and collect those hearts, which also proves his movement skills, the player with this powerup even can fight normally while getting his hearts auto filled up.

You really like the health idea? Whats about getting....invisibility, but too bad it breaks coz the enemy can predict where you are. But be careful, this requires skill!

Arrob wrote:

You take away a big part of traditional tactics and skills required (escaping, movement).

Absolutely not.
As you said:

Arrob wrote:

adding a option to randomly (based on powerup spawn)

You can't rely on getting the health powerup.
But on the other hand: The rune can be cought to escape, but maybe you have to change your direction to catch the rune? It would require more movement skills AND tactical knowledge. Can you go for it? Is it REALLY worth? Can i get away fast enough, or will I lose time and die?

BUT: You can rely on getting a powerup each 90s.
Is it worth fighting for? Maybe you will focus on getting each spawned powerup?

Arrob wrote:

The only reasons i can think of are making new players starts easier, and adding diversity for its own purpose.

Now you got affected by this neat slopes-discussion. How the f*ck will a more complex gameplay, with more tactics and strategies where you need more experience, give new players an easier start?

Arrob wrote:

Both are not worth to sacrifice what you need to to add it.

What exactly will we sacrifice with runes? The plane mid and uninteresting mid, that is just "this long path to the other base"?

6 (edited by Arrob 2013-08-24 22:41:44)

Re: [SUGGESTION] Rune Mod idea for the next version

First i want to say: No offense, but way too much quotes, you use more quotes from my post than this post has lines.
It damages clarity and obscures essential statements.

Slayer *gV* wrote:

Now you got affected by this neat slopes-discussion. How the f*ck will a more complex gameplay, with more tactics and strategies where you need more experience, give new players an easier start?

First to adress your points:
The "tactics" you add is go for powerup or not. this is nothing special and worth to add. You force players to consider this, or theill face disadvantages, instead of letting players develop their own tactics (which is the true meaning of tactics from my point of view, nothing forced). You ask how runes make new players starts easier?
just because code gets more comples, doesnt mean game does. I noticed that in Quake Live, where as a newbie i only got average stats (thanks to matchmaking you only fight other newbies). But i collected some powerups, which is nothing complex, and with quadra damage i got fat kill streaks. It gives good feeling as newbie, but if you think of it you notice that you dont got these kills because you improved youself (which is way too slow/limited for most gamers) but only due to that powerup.

Slayer *gV* wrote:

Yes. You can go and collect them, or collect a powerup. But better take a big load of luck with you, maybe it is only a regeneration rune, that will break upon the first impact, meaning you wont get anything - too bad.

Slayer *gV* wrote:

You really like the health idea? Whats about getting....invisibility, but too bad it breaks coz the enemy can predict where you are. But be careful, this requires skill!

I got some facts out of these quotes that were unknown to me before. I really hope this is not going to happen, but the way you said it lets me expect opposite. I once made a topic why i love teeworlds.
Very important points were the 100% skill dependency, 0% luck which is essential for me in a serious pvp game.
Although its hard to find a game which does not feature luck, there are still some very few games that stay true to skill. Teeworlds was one of those game, but if you add invisibility, and even powerups that grant LUCK-BASED
bonuses, you give up all this. I am open to discuss most issues, and i even would give health regen runes a try.
But invisibility and luck ist a nogo, if you implement this, you have jsut ruined every single gamemode that will contain it, and you cant discuss that with me. Sorry but not invisibility and luck.
I also enjoyed the "easy to learn, hard to master" philosophy, which you seem to oppose with adding "complex" stuff to add "tactics" (i disagree with the correct use of these words here).

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Re: [SUGGESTION] Rune Mod idea for the next version

This discussion was originally posted in this thread // Landil

Antoine de Saint Exupéry: It seems that perfection is reached not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.
Besides -  I am the gfx guy!

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Re: [SUGGESTION] Rune Mod idea for the next version

im glad this is still flagged as suggestion, thought this was already approved and coming in the next version.