101 Reply by Slinack (edited by Slinack 2013-01-03 23:00:37)

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Alright, we can at least put it this way: it knows what it doesn't want.
Not everyone playing vanilla likes to map; not everyone has the skills to.

Sonix just did a great map. Ubuntu made ctf_lava.

I think creativity may be an issue (But then the community is very conservative regarding this point. I guess we still lack maps like the ones we are used to. Maybe not ready to try new stuff. Weird.)

But you can look at the popular maps and see how they were well thought by experienced players (*edit: ctf2 was a gift from the matrix *). That was my point.
I'm not saying new players can't come up with good stuff. If they keep vanilla principles in mind, I guess it would be fine.

Anyway, zetman is just pretty simple and fun and we didn't give it much of a thought (it was made really quickly). It was never intended to be a serious map, so there is no reason to bring it up to this discussion.

check out these maps: infiltrate - choco - dustycloud

102 Reply by Kirbs (edited by Kirbs 2013-01-03 23:52:37)

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Most of the maps put up so far are pretty good..

Anyway...Zgokee, if your knowledge of vanilla is so high, Why don't you make any maps? Or just here to judge? By the way.. My knowledge of vanilla isn't as high as instagib, and that may be a reason. (But higher than ddrace.)

Zgokee wrote:

I believe Lord Kirby is, as yemDX would put it, a DDkid.

(Bleah? Sorry,I never play ddrace as it sucks
I would take that as a small insult, lets just drop it please
smile Ask traitor about the instagib knowledge)

no

103 Reply by Sonix (edited by Sonix 2013-01-04 00:53:26)

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Broken wrote:

I'm a little worried the "map working group" might become a little too inbred with only a few people saying what might be good/fun.

The fact that maps like Selva (his ctf too) have gotten turned down and yet mediocre maps like dm9 get accepted gives me cause for concern.

You're wrong here,as I said everyone is free to express their opinions about the submitted maps (who said we wouldn't take note).

Selva is a nice map and also was discussed about it's position as official one on it's thread as far as I saw. You can find the answers there.
Imo dm9 is a nice map and pretty unique,I like playing 1on1's on it with my mates I don't get why you hate it.

Broken wrote:

I know people who would do the work to make a map but since the probability seems high they won't be considered, they never put the work in.

TW is a small enough community that I really don't see why any map that good has to be turned down. Just my opinion.

That's why the Map working group is here? To give an opportunity.

104 Reply by Broken

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Sonix wrote:
Broken wrote:

I'm a little worried the "map working group" might become a little too inbred with only a few people saying what might be good/fun.

The fact that maps like Selva (his ctf too) have gotten turned down and yet mediocre maps like dm9 get accepted gives me cause for concern.

You're wrong here,as I said everyone is free to express their opinions about the submitted maps (who said we wouldn't take note).

Selva is a nice map and also was discussed about it's position as official one on it's thread as far as I saw. You can find the answers there.
Imo dm9 is a nice map and pretty unique,I like playing 1on1's on it with my mates I don't get why you hate it.

Broken wrote:

I know people who would do the work to make a map but since the probability seems high they won't be considered, they never put the work in.

TW is a small enough community that I really don't see why any map that good has to be turned down. Just my opinion.

That's why the Map working group is here? To give an opportunity.


Lol. OK, so you like dm9, well what if I like Selva. Who decides that dm9 is better? How does the map working group give an opportunity for Selva? Did I have any say in that? The reasons for denying Selva were inadequate, in my opinion. Where is my opportunity to change that?

Free to take note? Did someone "take note" of it? I don't want people's opinions to be "taken note" of but to have actual power to adopt maps. It feels like a meaningless buzz word, well you worked hard on a map we'll "take note" of it.

All you basically said in your post was, feel free to say your opinion, but still only the "map working" groups opinion seems to matter here? I don't feel like anything I said made any impact on you whatsoever?

In sum, it appears I'm not wrong at all. I wasn't talking about "taking note," I said "to few people have the say on what is good/fun." Sorry but  it's pretty frustrating from my perspective.

105 Reply by Sonix (edited by Sonix 2013-01-04 04:54:15)

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Broken wrote:

Lol. OK, so you like dm9, well what if I like Selva. Who decides that dm9 is better?

Why do we have to compare 2 different maps? Where selva is 3x times bigger than dm9.
If you don't like the map just don't play it.

Broken wrote:

How does the map working group give an opportunity for Selva? Did I have any say in that? The reasons for denying Selva were inadequate, in my opinion. Where is my opportunity to change that?

You didn't propose it here,yet ^^
since the things changed it may get a chance, who knows,just propose it here.

Broken wrote:

Free to take note? Did someone "take note" of it? I don't want people's opinions to be "taken note" of but to have actual power to adopt maps. It feels like a meaningless buzz word, well you worked hard on a map we'll "take note" of it.

Power to adopt maps? This would get out of control,trust me.
Also did you read that "Well you worked hard on a map we'll take note of it" maps where is obviously clear that the user gave some effort and the map is nice but not suitable as official,will get a mark and hosted on various "custom maps" servers.

Broken wrote:

All you basically said in your post was, feel free to say your opinion, but still only the "map working" groups opinion seems to matter here? I don't feel like anything I said made any impact on you whatsoever?

You (community in general) are the map working group and not me.
And what else did you say except whining?

106 Reply by Dune

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Broken, the map working group isn't a decision group, it's for feeding the people in charge of the map development with applications, not to actually let the community decide of their maps (ye! roma desertcamp lost as a standard rotation!).

Not Luck, Just Magic.

107 Reply by BeaR (edited by BeaR 2013-01-11 15:49:22)

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

My personal opinion/critisism about the following three maps, I hope you can read my handwriting ^^
I want to show off more what could be improved imho than whats already correct or good (:

dm_rainy

Graphics: Colors could be nicer for the background and the bushes, also doodads shouldn't be visible when disabling HD. The raindrops and the water are perhaps a good idea but the implementation could be impoved much /:

Gameplay: The middle part has too much free room imho, also there are plenty of hearts and shields, which are way too much. Please take care of the propotions, at some places it's too narrow and on others it's too empty.

http://i.solidfiles.net/b96336c694.png


dm_bambu

Graphics: they look cute and I dont see much too improve, maybe the vegetation could be a bit more dense but well subjective..

Gameplay: Looks a bit like dm1, maybe that could be changed big_smile Overall the gameplay is quite smooth. At some places there are too much small 'steps' (?) and there could be more hearts and armor. But I think you can see it better in the image (:

http://i.solidfiles.net/f512c1821a.png


dm_lazy

Graphics: Quite similiar too bambu^^, so not much too say, except the background gradient colors could be changed.

Gameplay: The gameplay is in dm_bambu better than here: there are too much long, straight ways(vertical and horizontal), also the amount of shields is too low, the left down part should be reworked at all, it doesnt really fit to the rest of the map imho ):

http://i.solidfiles.net/982533275e.png

108 Reply by Variecs

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

So... yeah, it's way past 10th.

109 Reply by BeaR (edited by BeaR 2013-01-18 19:36:01)

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Proposal:

#Map:
ctf_auroch

#Download:
https://downloads.teeworlds.com/solidfi … auroch.map

#Notes:
This one differs a bit from, the version I posted in the Map Subforum

110 Reply by Broken

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Sonix wrote:

And what else did you say except whining?

I really don't think anything I said was whining, I clearly said it seems a certain way that makes me concerned.

Whining is complaining unnecessarily in an immature fashion.

111 Reply by Sonix

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Variecs wrote:

So... yeah, it's way past 10th.

I will post the results as soon as possible.

However, now you're able to test all the proposed MWG maps on our public server called Official Map Development (under 0.7) and it has got also some test maps I'm currently making.

thanks for the submission BeaR, ctf_auroch was also added into the server. ^^

112 Reply by Variecs

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Wait, there were some graphic changes in 0.7. Is there graphic bugs in my map when u launch it there?

113 Reply by Sonix

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Variecs wrote:

Wait, there were some graphic changes in 0.7. Is there graphic bugs in my map when u launch it there?

Yeah ^^

114 Reply by Lachn007

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

i am pretty good at making maps.

0.0
MISSINGNO. APPEARED

115 Reply by Zatline

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Lachn007 wrote:

i am pretty good at making maps.

Show us your skills by posting your best maps! wink

[SKINS] by Zatline  [GAMESKIN] Portal v2

116 Reply by Lachn007

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

how do you take pictures of your map to post up?

0.0
MISSINGNO. APPEARED

117 Reply by Variecs

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Updated the graphics and added a few other changes. Now it should be fine.
https://www.teeworlds.com/forum/viewtop … 81#p103881

118 Reply by Sonix

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Here we are,sorry for keeping you wait that much.
About the dm maps I pretty agree on the things that BeaR wrote.
However,after testing a while with Magnet, dm_bambu seems a pretty nice and fun map,actually looks like a big dm1 version ^^; although them map still needs some tweaks:
- try to make the ways less spam-able (there different well covered spam places)
- the pickups are placed a way too un-natural,try to spread 'em more on the map smile
- rework a bit the mid hole fill some space.. and don't forget: don't copy the dm1-like hearts placements looks boring and unoriginal.

Once done those fixes the map could get Quality marked or even more, who knows tongue
keep up on mapping. ^^

Now ctf maps,
ctf_stars is another good map I've been testing and I've also to say that is quite nice as a ctf 1on1 map. smile
Thought it could be and endurance challenge with 4 players 'cause the ways are pretty unbalanced,well at least the upper one should be reworked because it's so fast that you couldn't have time to capture that the enemy would grab it again,yeah that's quite boring.
The background graphics are pretty lolz.
Nothing more to add you are free to contact me again once you've edited the map so that we could see with the rest of juries what to do with it. smile

ctf_auroch, I like it's simple structure, it's fun to play on it and the graphics are nice (still there's a little bug on caves bg) but, it has got a little issue that could ruin the gameplay, the mid, once a player passed the mid he would find himself on a safe place meaning that would be covered by the teammate that is spamming in there.
That's why it's actually a bit hard to stop an enemy there,you can make the mid bigger and less narrow.

119 Reply by Delo

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

nice to hear this sonix! smile
i will rework the middle soon!

visit our clan!
=Eagle=

120 Reply by Variecs (edited by Variecs 2013-01-23 02:45:45)

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Tough task to achieve, Sonix. Right now one of the ways to capture the flag is going down, then up to the rifle spot and then back down, coming into the base. I guess i could make something like that at the top: lower the obstacle down there together with the rifle spot while highly increasing the size of an obstacle attached to the top. But that requires creating more place to move there, and totally reworking mid section. Anyway, i've seen something is wrong with the mid section myself and already started to think, now i'll just have to speed up my work.
I'll see what i can do.
By the way, are you laughing on the old or the new background? Cuz i actually didn't get it big_smile

121 Reply by RUSterrorist (edited by RUSterrorist 2013-02-15 14:37:46)

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Magnet wrote:

This is a community process: everyone can simply propose their maps for inclusion in Teeworlds, granted:
- they accept to license their work under the TW license
- their map is accepted by the Jury.

I will lead a Jury composed of different TW players from all ranges of playing level to make sure each map we deliver is fun for most categories of players. No need to apply to the jury here, but if you're interested and committed just talk to me on IRC. Be patient as I'm often away wink. Anyway feel free to take initiative and if you're committed and have good taste, consider yourself a member of the group and make whatever you want happen. I want everyone who feels he should be part of this to be with us.

Bullshit.
Having a "Jury" of 5 or another random low number to decide about the possibility of a Map to become offical is just stupid.
Since I can say already that it doesn´t matter in the most cases how good the Map is, a big part will depend on who created the Map.
If Ubu will make a Map Sonix and Magnet will love it so much and if the rest of the "Jury" complains noone gives a fuck, this 2 guys will argue the shit out of them.
If there would be a random unknown guy making an excellent gameplay map but, lets say with a shitty background they will destroy the map and it wont be seen again.
There shouldn´t be a Jury to decide about it, the "Maps" section is good enough for it. If you want to make a Mapping group, make it create maps post them in the section and enjoy the criticism.

The developers or whoever is responsible for releasing new official Maps should just take a look in there which maps got positive criticism and which not. Then you could announce something like a vote and create a server with the best Maps you found, so the whole community (or at least the Forum active community) can decide about it.
Not only 5 guys or another random low number.

I didn´t read everything, just the first post till i read that shit with "Jury"

122 Reply by Dune

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Welcome back.

Not Luck, Just Magic.

123 Reply by unsigned char*

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

This is a open/free source.. but is a private/closed community.. for this i only make things for me... and not contribute in the official repo... smile

Free Source - Free work
When the staff is willing to discuss ideas ... My work will be open to such reviews.

Why I'm a pointer? http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Zem9Ozn7BOo/T … itchie.jpg

124 Reply by Sonix

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

Hey Rusterrorist,
I must say that we still have no jury,we had some intentions on making it but,then we abandoned it and I agree with the things you said on your post, everyone is free to test the proposed maps and give some feedback about them also, we are running some servers where all the MWG maps are stored in and fully test-able ( I would also like to have one on 0.6 too but.. ) and still I didn't see so many comments about the maps posted,or well,there is so few people caring about this as far as I saw.

So as I said everyone is free to propose and give feedback to the others who are taking part,we have no jury and I don't think we'll have one.

125 Reply by heinrich5991

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Re: A new "Map Working Group"

I do not know wrote:

This is a open/free source.. but is a private/closed community.. for this i only make things for me... and not contribute in the official repo... smile

Free Source - Free work
When the staff is willing to discuss ideas ... My work will be open to such reviews.

The question is also whether the community wants to discuss all the things. Just an idea.