[ Closed ] A new "Map Working Group" (Page 4 of 7)

I also submit this map, I didn't make it, but I'm submitting it because I think it has some spunk ^^

screenshot: http://i645.photobucket.com/albums/uu17 … 6ec03e.png

download: http://www.mediafire.com/?4g3q8cebimig1sv

The tileset is good, but the gameplay is horrible

OOPS
I meant to submit the tileset..
But what about desertcamp? If you hate that map you must be insane, and idiotic.
Zgokee.. I've seen you being a bit rude elsewhere, too..
If you have nothing nice to say... Then just don't say it.
In this case, lets see if the other members like it. Yes the gameplay is horrible, but the tileset is good.
and... now removing it... bye bye

My thoughts about this:

-Maps should be playable without hook -> all places reachable with doublejump

this one is about being beginner friendly

- official map pack worked on separetly of the actuall game dev

Official map packs offer some independence from the game dev. These can be released more frequently and add some spice again.

- We need lots of love for the map editor

Maybe this is cause i ´m not into this anymore but i want some fancy effects done with envelope editor in official maps like avalanches in snow maps, vulcan eruptions,rain,waterfalls, some smoke of battlefields etc.  I have read some nice quote lately " Games are like songs, The lyrics are the gameplay the melody are the graphics" so improve the graphics we got the tools and everything.

- Still no official/approved servers hosted

Okay this one depends on how you look at it.  But i´d like some servers with a simple map rotation and map_vote turned off.

- MOST important point comes at last: KEEP THE COMMUNITY ENTERTAINED

The most crucial point is none of these all above will ever work if the community isnt entertained. The thing is we all do this in our freetime and this is the point when i should stop talking. Since noone ever wants to work in his/her freetime for ppl which only cry cry for you doing something for them. But i havent read about one tournament/ Gather playing for ages.

Sincere Marik

That doesn't mean if the map is accesible without hook everywhere that is already suitable for vanilla,there also other criterias.
And you should stop proposing non-vanilla mods maps, desertcamp isn't good at all for vanilla example are the ways the upper one is mostly unused and the bases are way too open (just 2 fully visible examples,there also more).
Don't talk here about tileset proposals,instead you should ask graphic artists about that.

Would you please read better and not ask the same questions over and over? Thanks for your cooperation.

Can you stop whining?

Please try to read the whole text before asking useless questions.
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This totally proves that your vanilla knownledge is very low.

Ctf2 is totally different than desertcamp. Just take a look at their structure.

Wouldn't it be easier to have a "map working group" if you could work on maps together as a group easily? You know, a collaborative map editor.

yemDX, this might be difficult to realise, but working together with others is not easy - do you know of successful examples? Well, my last map has been made with one more person and it took us weeks until we were happy with our result

I am glad you took time to answer me, hopefully you can do this to others too, even when I think you are busy testing maps and discussing those.
So far I will not comment every single objection, but the one about used tilesets. We tried to work with default tilesets on most parts and reduced the filesize as much as possible, so our nomination is meant as placeholder: change graphics as needed (should be easy on our map) and maybe rework specific parts, if the map is sufficient potentially.
In our case this would be a lot of work as I understand you. But because of my missing expereince at CTF I would have to leave the task to other qualified persons.

As a basic principle I would like to add:
sometimes you just feel comfortable at a new map, other times you need to adapt, learn its mechanic / movement / gameplay and you might like it or not, get used to it at least. Based on my own experiences within the "iCTF scene" I know about the reluctance to try new maps a few times and not giving up disappointed after the first visit... I felt like forcing people into other maps, but for myself I need maprotation most fo the times.
So break old habits and stop presenting only variations of known maps, thats why I nominated this map. Making a different impression, with graphics (could be easily changed) and movement paths (lots of, as you know from my map ).

This is a useful comment, providing some new general ideas!
- The first part is reasonable, though I do not want to accept it: new added maps do not have to follow this rule in my opinion. You need to find a balance between long time players and early beginners. These people should be able to find a place to learn about the most important part of the game, the hook. Giving an example at a tutorial like map would be much better (I remember seeing something like that on fng gametype: a map with a tileset included which guides you with arrows and teeworlds using the hook at certain points!).

- About the animations: I would like to request these too, the game is capable of much more than we see in the default maps. Always I am missing a 2nd level of details you could enable or disable, for moving parts and really lovely animations! But to grant compatibilty on older machines you have to disable all of these things in the editor. Well thats an additional thought, but take a look at ctf_canyon to see a rather old map with lots of pretty details. Unnecessary you say? Even distracting? So disable the details but it gives a nice impression to new players, don't you think?
So this is a great idea, I think.

- About your suggestion to share map packs, thats what I do for some time now for iCTF mode - yes it is a small community of regular players, but they could only benefit of bugfree versions. You can find more about it at this thread (section 1). Because I keep my collection up to date at another forum I dont want to post it here again...

So, your last comment, Broken, shouts for a user supervised additional map pack. You could start something like that, with useful comments and questions about worthy maps.

Sure I got that, but it is not easy at all - so if you (or anyone) really wants to cooperate on creating a map
you can find a way: create a website or space to share the file, even a messager program could help and you do some parts or a draft and let others look at it. Get some reply and ideas, and maybe they want to add some stuff too. Afterwards you can go on with their version and so on.
It is possible even now, just begin

Wow, I feel upset again... but here is an answer without response to your aggressive part.

Question is, who would really use this (certainely complex) feature when you can work on a map together, right now?

This is like asking "Who would really use cars when you can walk to places, right now?"

It's about getting to the same destination faster. Instead of sending editions back and forth, all people involved can work on it at the same time.

Just a few opinions of mine:

- When Marik says you should be able to reach every part of the map without hooking, he doesn't mean you have to be able to double jump from a specific point to another DIRECTLY. Although I agree we already have newbie-friendly maps and that's not a main concern (it's a nice touch).

But huge open spaces are really terrible for a variety of reasons. When combined with long vertical paths... ugh. Keep that in mind please.

- Stop with those dm1 ripoffs, please.

- I don't think graphics should get fancy. It's cool to see a nice background such as in ctf_lava and others (which I can't really remember since HD is off) but I guess that's it.
Teeworlds is really cute with its current doodads and bgs. Jungle looks really good.
Please don't try to make it bloated and heavy.

- I know everyone just wants to help and all. But if you don't play vanilla, why submitting a map at all? (And then some get mad for not being accepted or claim things are getting decided by only a few people and nothing will pass).
The criticism is really hard towards vanilla maps, specially ctf ones, because the actual vanilla community knows what it wants. One could say they want "another ctf2", but that's not what I meant. We feel the game: the speed, the movements, the pickup placement, the strategies to get in and out of base, whether or not to risk going somewhere or doing something.

Don't you think it's a bit pretentious to come out of nowhere and expect to make a good map?

- And to finish: a collaborative map editor would make creating drafts (which can be a pain the ass, unless you mean drafts in the editor) and sending them over unnecessary; it would reduce working time; it would prevent more conflicts between creators (it's easier to come up with an idea together than to choose between two solid ones already finished up). Come on, it'd be real time editting.