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Topic: Two suggestions

I haven't read trough the forums really, and it might be that these have been suggested before and then rejected/modified/etc, sorry if these are old.

The mouse right now irritares me badly. The way the screen follows the mouse feels just stupid. If you ask me, the screen should follow the mouse all the time. Camera movement should be the half of the mouse movement. Right now the camera follows the mouse when the mouse and the boundaries of the screen have some less than 25% of screen height/width of distance between them.

Anything like file logging possible? Kill logs, server event logs etc.?

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Re: Two suggestions

it makes sense and i support it

as an option

my name is NOT clasic_traveller_die its CLASIC_TRAVELLER_DIEHARD classic traveller is a si-fi rpg from the same era as dungens and dragons lookit up on wikipedia smile

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Re: Two suggestions

Clawbug wrote:

If you ask me, the screen should follow the mouse all the time.

That would certainly be interesting to try. I can´t really predict if it would be better, but it may very well be.

4 (edited by ShootMe 2008-03-08 08:23:30)

Re: Two suggestions

For me I don't think the mouse-to-screen locking option would be very fun, especailly to a lot of people because I move my mouse quite a bit from left to right up and down and that movement is fast meaning my screen would be constantly moving around the place and that would prolly make me dizzy and irritated as I would assume have the same affect on others as well.

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Re: Two suggestions

Well, what I meant was the way Soldat handles the screen following the mouse. Right now I find it somehow awkward to use the mouse to look around and move + aim. IMO my suggested way of handling this would certainly help with this and make the gameplay more enjoyable.

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Re: Two suggestions

hate to burst bubble but this isn't soldat and we shouldn't try to emulated it

but there could be a control to increase the degree in which the screen follows the mouse

my name is NOT clasic_traveller_die its CLASIC_TRAVELLER_DIEHARD classic traveller is a si-fi rpg from the same era as dungens and dragons lookit up on wikipedia smile

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Re: Two suggestions

the Screen following can be turned off by deactivating the "dynamic camera" option

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Re: Two suggestions

The reason why we have a dead zone in the middle is because it makes the whole screen more stable when you play. If the "camera" always follows the mouse, you can get kinda dizzy. But I don't see why we couldn't have it as on option.

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Re: Two suggestions

clasic_traveller_diehard wrote:

hate to burst bubble but this isn't soldat and we shouldn't try to emulated it

but there could be a control to increase the degree in which the screen follows the mouse

Of course, I never meant to make Soldat clone, but IMO the way Soldat handles the mouse just fits the game. Thus I assume it would fit Teewars aswell, even though we have faster movement.

And then if the camera doesn't follow the mouse.. The enemies will see you before you see them, not an option really. tongue

What about the file logging? Going to happen?

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Re: Two suggestions

About the file logging, http://ix.teewars.com/trac/ticket/312

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Re: Two suggestions

Thanks! wink

I don't want to open a new thread again, thus I use this. Could it be possible to have an option to show FPS ingame? I am aware of debug=1, but it includes so much other useless stuff that it isn't very practical solution for me.

(I run slow(400MHz Celeron, 512MB RAM and GeForce4 MX 4000) machine with Linux, thus I am rather interested to see how the machine performs overall.)

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Re: Two suggestions

Clawbug wrote:

Of course, I never meant to make Soldat clone, but IMO the way Soldat handles the mouse just fits the game. Thus I assume it would fit Teewars aswell, even though we have faster movement.

And then if the camera doesn't follow the mouse.. The enemies will see you before you see them, not an option really. tongue

That's exactly the point. It fits Soldat, therefor it isn't likely to fit Teewars as well. The movement is a lot faster here, don't just brush that aspect off like that.

Having the dynamic camera setting turned off works well for me. It is an option. I suggest you try it out.

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Re: Two suggestions

KRD wrote:
Clawbug wrote:

Of course, I never meant to make Soldat clone, but IMO the way Soldat handles the mouse just fits the game. Thus I assume it would fit Teewars aswell, even though we have faster movement.

And then if the camera doesn't follow the mouse.. The enemies will see you before you see them, not an option really. tongue

That's exactly the point. It fits Soldat, therefor it isn't likely to fit Teewars as well. The movement is a lot faster here, don't just brush that aspect off like that.

Having the dynamic camera setting turned off works well for me. It is an option. I suggest you try it out.

Well, just see how you use your mouse when you move. You aim towards the direction of your movement, as far as you can aim, to see further and to spot the enemies as fast as possible. With the Soldat-like mouse you don't need to change the aiming habbit at all. I have no intention to try to make the game Soldat-alike, I used to play Soldat for many years, in competitive level with some actual success, got enough of that game long time ago.

IF the idea is to make as unique game as possible, by trying to do everything in different way, then the approach is  wrong IMO. If you see something seems to work well for the other product, why not to try to use it, and see if it works better than the current system? Besides, if the approach was to stay away from other games and not to be a clone, then why to even take 2D shooter with gravity and fast gameplay - copied from Soldat(which were taken from Quake, Liero, CS etc., which have countless actual direct clones). Thus the "This is no Soldat" sounds very strange to me.

14 (edited by Mat 2008-03-08 15:59:24)

Re: Two suggestions

KRD: dynamic camera increasing ur veiw radius and it IS very important in TW (dont say to me that knowledge of enemy location isn't important thing cool).

15 (edited by KRD 2008-03-08 16:07:56)

Re: Two suggestions

Clawbug wrote:

Well, just see how you use your mouse when you move. You aim towards the direction of your movement, as far as you can aim, to see further and to spot the enemies as fast as possible. With the Soldat-like mouse you don't need to change the aiming habbit at all. I have no intention to try to make the game Soldat-alike, I used to play Soldat for many years, in competitive level with some actual success, got enough of that game long time ago.

I only aim in the direction I'm moving in about half the time on Teewars. Yes, in Soldat it really is the way you describe, most likely because the maps are large and don't have as much vertical room, but Teewars is a lot more chaotic and the movement is not as easy to predict. A lot of the time you can't be sure which direction enemies will come from, while on Soldat you really do have your allies behind you and your enemies in front of you more often than not.

Clawbug wrote:

IF the idea is to make as unique game as possible, by trying to do everything in different way, then the approach is  wrong IMO. If you see something seems to work well for the other product, why not to try to use it, and see if it works better than the current system? Besides, if the approach was to stay away from other games and not to be a clone, then why to even take 2D shooter with gravity and fast gameplay - copied from Soldat(which were taken from Quake, Liero, CS etc., which have countless actual direct clones). Thus the "This is no Soldat" sounds very strange to me.

The developers have said in the past Quake was a source of inspiration, but they never mentioned Soldat. I would say it's very possible you see Teewars as a copy of it only because you've played the game extensively. This thread in the Community News forum didn't come up with all that many games that resemble Teewars:

http://www.teewars.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=773

Mat wrote:

KRD: dynamic camera increasing ur veiw radius and it IS very important in TW (dont say to me that knowledge of enemy location isn't important thing cool).

It's by far not as important as it is in Soldat. At least if you're playing on an interesting map that allows attacking from more than one direction. And while the dynamic camera lets you see further in one direction, it cuts the view off on the other end, which is a really bad idea if you're playing against more than one opponent.

Anyway, Matricks already said he doesn't mind experimenting with the way the dynamic camera works. I'll stick with my static camera, though. wink

16 (edited by Dreamy 2008-03-08 16:50:41)

Re: Two suggestions

I have also felt that controling the camera movement feels a little awkward (and I haven´t played Soldat, Teewars is the only shooter I´ve played much). So spontaniusly Clawbugs idea does sound good to me, allthough like I said I don´t really know how it would turn out.

I assume that matricks point about the dizzyness is valid. So, assuming that, maybe it´s rather a matter of balancing it? That is, not having the screen always following the mouse, but tighten the borders for where it starts to?

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Re: Two suggestions

Right now: The camera movement isn't static when moving the mouse from edge of the screen to another.
My suggested idea: The camera movement IS static when moving mouse from edge of the screen to another.

Basically the camera x/y moves half the speed mouse x/y moves, like in Soldat. IMO this is WAY easier to get used to, and yet way easier to handle well. Makes aiming easier a bit, I think.

Right now the cursor moves in circular "pattern". When you put the cursor to very left/right edge, and start moving it upwards, it actually starts moving in a shape of a circle. When you think you have moved the mouse some 1/4th of a screen, the Tee aims WAY more upwards. Thus it is VERY hard for new people to actually aim properly with the cursor when using dynamic mouse. The suggestion above simplifies this alot, and IMO the game would be way more "noob friendly" and easier to "get into".

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Re: Two suggestions

Clawbug, turn off dynamic camera and ur problem is solved.

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Re: Two suggestions

http://ix.teewars.com/trac/ticket/313 - a variable to just show the current fps
http://ix.teewars.com/trac/ticket/314 - make the dynamic camera more customizable

20 (edited by Clawbug 2008-03-08 17:44:04)

Re: Two suggestions

No it is not. When usin dynamic camera, one can zoom farther than others, thus giving an advantage in 1v1 situations. Besides, not really a big problem, but just an suggestion to make the game easier to get into.

E: Thanks, Matricks

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Re: Two suggestions

Dreamy wrote:

That would certainly be interesting to try. I can´t really predict if it would be better, but it may very well be.

Hrm... Sounds interesting but the limit to looking down etcetera keeps teewars interesting.

No, that is not me; it's just a figment of your imagination.

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Re: Two suggestions

i got the dynamic camera off
if it will be on and it will be improved-this will force seriuos gamers to move the camera rapidly that will cause dizziness

23 (edited by Chrono Syndrome 2008-03-09 10:49:25)

Re: Two suggestions

hate to burst bubble but this isn't soldat and we shouldn't try to emulated it

Sure, Soldat is a bad game, but not SO bad.

Don't try to catch the Night !
Useless simplifications is worst enemy of simplicity. (C)

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Re: Two suggestions

Chrono Syndrome wrote:

hate to burst bubble but this isn't soldat and we shouldn't try to emulated it

Sure, Soldat is a bad game, but not SO bad.

Games is great! ...community isn't, especially not the clan people. sad


Well, about Teewars! I got even more suggestions! Instagib mode and ability to disable the powerup server side, already suggested. Instagib with some sort of überlaser cannon and unlimited ammo + 3 second delay between shots.

The powerup is, well, whoreable. In most servers there is jsut 1 or 2 people who sit and wait for it and then make some 6 kills spree and repeat that 3-4 times and win whole match before others have even the half of the frags - IMO thats no good. Usually people spawning and then one comes with the powerup and there is this "Well, sucks to be you now! wink"-situation. tongue Well moving player can escape with real chances of getting away though! big_smile

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Re: Two suggestions

The powerup is, well, whoreable. In most servers there is jsut 1 or 2 people who sit and wait for it

That is just stupid newbies...

and win whole match before others have even the half of the frags

lol! Dude, are u good player? I think not wink