less damage for laser after bouncing? (Page 1 of 3)

i think the laser should be removed completely. i never liked that this weapon has been added to teeworlds

I agree with Snazzy the laser, the way it is right now, should be removed. I would like to see something more like the lightning gun from Quake  ( already coded here : http://www.teeworlds.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=5471) a dmg over time weapon, which fits more the position of a chasing weapon.

Right now the basic use of the weapons is like this:
default weapons

Gun: range weapon, chasing and detection
Hammer: close combat

collectable weapons

Shotgun: close combat in combination with hook
Grenade launcher: Movement (Rocket jumping although it is a grenade ), main dmg output, mid range
Laser: Long range, Burst dmg, chasing weapon

In my opinion it doesn´t feel correct to use the laser for chasing down the flag carrier.
I would increase the damage and the reload time of the laser and remove the bounce. With the bigger burst dmg it becomes more valuable.

I would say reducing the dmg after a bounce is the wrong direction it weakens the already weak laser even more.

EDIT:

This happens so rarely that someone controlles the laser bounce most of these kills are unintended.

thats wrong
bounce cost is for decreasing the range after bouncing, see http://www.teeworlds.com/?page=docs& … rverTuning

(laser_bounce_cost: Remove this much from reach when laser is bouncing.)

The bounce makes the laser unique from all the other weapons.  Recently I've started mastering the bounce and I have often used it to hit the player before they hit me. They don't even think about using the bonce but I do which gives me a huge advantage. I'm kind of on both ends... It makes it unique but for the most part it deals dmg by chance.
Probably reducing the laser bounce dmg is the best thing but I don't think it shouldn't go under 3 dmg. I prefer 4 dmg on bonce but if the majority deems 3 dmg better, I'll settle.

What makes the rifle and laser different is in close combat if you have a hard time perfectly aiming at your enemy when he's spinning you in circles with his hook, the rifle lets you deal damage even if don't hit him right on. I guess to a pro, there is none, but with my ping in most severs it's very useful.

I wanna take part to this thread bucause it's really an interesting argument. Before thinking I wanna quote that:

In my opinion, removing the laser would be a really good solution. But what about all the instagib community?
Let's think to the future before doing anything. Removing the laser would probably make angry a large part of our community, and looking at today situation this part it's maybe our main part. Teeworlds Vanilla is not more played, because people prefers to have fun inside stupid and useless mods. We should convert them, teaching them vanilla is better and more competitive, not kick them by deleting their favorite weapon...

Concluding, that's a nice idea but not the right way. We should do something, yes, but not remove the weapon. In the past this has already been discussed with 2 good solutions from Golv and from the Teestrike mod.
LINK: http://www.teeworlds.com/forum/viewtopi … 572#p58572
Another good point is the lighting gun from Quake Marik already posted, that is already coded and that could replace the actual rifle.
About the bounce, I think it's need atm. Thinking about Vanilla gameplay, it's not simply a luckshot. Looking at instagib bots problem is the only way to detect simple cheats. Maybe heinrich5991, you are right: but only inside instagib cuz here is too powerful.

How complex and useless.
- Add tune laser_bounce_cost 2 in your config
- Host it
- Play it

I already played some instagib wars without bounces, and we loved it.

I think that the main problem of the rifle is that we can not dodge the lasers, so even if you can predict that a player will kill you with the rifle, even if he spams laser, he can kill you and you can't do anything against that ; even if you are a pro player you are dead if your enemy has a good aim.

This is not the case of the grenade launcher : if someone spams grenades, you can avoid it (and you don't need to be pro to do that), and that's why the grenade launcher is fair.

Maybe some people kill with the bounce of the laser on purpose, but nobody can say that he had ever dodged a laser bounce on purpose ; and that's why we can think that the bounce of the laser is unfair.

To fix it, a solution could be to make the lasers slower, i mean that you could be able to see the laser coming to you, and maybe dodge it. Or, if the problem is only related to the bounce of the laser, a solution could be to increase the time between the direct shot and the bounce.

Anyway, the rifle is currently the only weapon which is not liked by all the players, something should be done to fix it, and it will be needed to host mods or tuned servers to see which way is the best to make the rifle better.

yeah, listen to dune. (not being sarcastic)
the laser hardly appears on most maps. there are only 2 on ctf2, whereas there are 8 grenade launchers and 4 shotguns.

solution: play custom maps?

i just mastered the laser and do not want to see it removed

There still isn't a perfect chance that he will hit you and besides, I've always had the motto "If he can kill you, you can kill him" meaning, just kill him before he can kill you and problem solved. I know that isn't always easy but that's what I've done.

Yes, once they shoot and you're in the life of fire, you can't do anything. But I've had very good estimation skills enabling me to do many things like: guess where someone would shoot his laser bounce and not go there.

Maybe the second one... but I don't like the idea of changing the times because people have embeds it into their minds how long each of them take. Changing them causes players to relearn the weapon all over again.

Right, I often do that instinctivly, targetting ground to have better chances to hit. You particularly feel the difference on instagib servers. That's so lame it should be fixed.

maybe make the laser stop the tee for a sec ?, then you won't have to chase anymore, and the stopped tee still has a chance ?
it's just an idea, don't kill me

Laser should require you to load it up by pressing and holding the mouse key for a second or a half or something before you can release the beam. This would make it not be as instant, but still feasible for chasing. With this system, I'd be all for removing bounce and/or even making damage output higher.